Jeff, I only do worthless posts, or didn't you figure that out yet? :D I'll get them on here next week, hold your horses!

Hey Bean, thank you for your post. Unfortuneatly I've read it again and again, but I don't quite understand what's being said. I know you pasted from MegaSquirt. Is it saying that in other countries that those O2 sensors are really expensive then?

And what about MegaSquirt, is that something I might be interested in? What would it do for me?

Sorry, I have been travelling all day and my mind no worky to good, but I just can't quite figure out what's going on.

Jason

Mega is a stand alone efi controller that you build and program yourself. Really a bare bones, adaptable setup. If I remember right, the basic deal just controls fuel, then you can add a different module for spark, etc. etc.
One of the cheapest ways to go but some say not complex enough to provide all the tuning options.


Jeff-

So it sounds like it wouldn't be better at controlling all the variables than the stock ECU for the most part then? I think I'll try to get the thing up and running, and then maybe just spend the cash and get a turbo/chip setup from APR or someone like that who's spent a lot of time with it. From what I've read those guys tend to tune for longevity and driveability than just dyno numbers. Am I just being too cautious? Is there something better?

Jason

I could be waay off about Megasquirt... but the way I understand the product, it is a basic unit that allows you to develop your own fuel mapping from their base program. Ideal for tech savvy guys who want to spend hours mapping every micron of their fuel curve and trying to optimize power and driveability.
I bought a harness and ECU that is already programmed (not Mega) because I'm not really interested in learning fuel curve data logging. I like nuts and bolts, hands on tools, that kind of stuff. I don't have the patience to sit in the passenger seat for hours and ride around trying to develop a fuel map. G*d bless those that do! it's just not for me. I want plug and play.

If you can use the stock brain and harness, hell yeah that is the way to go! Most stock units have sooo much extra garbage that you won't be able to use but still need inputs and the average Joe doesn't know how to sort them out... they end up going with a Mega unit and starting from scratch. Plus, comparatively speaking, Mega is inexpensive (almost half what I paid for a Delphi for my Eco).

Megasquirt is a completely DIY ECU that a couple of guys are developing. They just sell the bespoke circuit board and you solder in all the components and processor and wire it all in yourself. So many people have done theirs now and the support from forums is huge that a lot of people now sell assembled units and develop the software so it is developing itself with some quite advanced finctions (like autotuning with a wideband O2 sensor).

Rich

Thanks Rich!
I was hoping someone would join in with Mega friendly advice.
I'm am definately scared of that which I do not understand so I'm not a fan of DIY electronics, BUT I wasn't trying to deter anyone else who's not a big scaredy chicken like me!
Like you said, A lot of people use the system and love it!

Well, initially i pasted the Mega site to show that those sensors shouldnt be more than $30 from VW. Maybe the site is old and the prices have risen sharply, but when i got mine last year, they were $30. Im glad it spawned a new discussion though. As for hours of tuning....the amount you put in is equal to what you get out. Fuel mapping isnt as hard as they would have you believe. Make some 100% passes and fill in the big stuff, then the rest just falls into place

Maybe I'm just not adventurous enough, but I figure that the factory probably has a couple of more brain cells into this setup than most people, and I tend to think that factory stuff is conservative so their product will last for awhile. Case in point, if the 180hp 1.8ts block was "strong enough", why did they bother to add a bunch of extra ribbing to the block and add extra oiling and piston squirters of the 225hp motor? It's only 45 more hp. Were they just bored?

Do the guys that say they have 300hp (180hp block) 1.8ts know more than the factory? I don't think so. They are cutting corners and the result is reduced longevity, reduced safety(ever seen a turbo motor fire? not pretty), and reduced drivability(yeah, I'm not really into having 300hp come on tap suddently at about 4000rpm). I just can't imagine that I would be able to tune something that the factory spent thousands of man hours on with data logging equipment that I don't have access to and get results that are superior in any way besides horsepower and torque numbers, which are only SOME of the important numbers you need to make something last for awhile. What about EGT, head temperature, transient oil pressure, knocking, fuel economy, water temp, and a bunch of stuff I've never even thought about, but I'm guess VAG did.

Here's a little something I thought about. If you put in a lightened flywheel or a turbo, your motor will spin up faster. What I suspect lags is the oil pressure/volume. Just slightly, but I think the oil is removed faster than it is replaced for just a few milliseconds before the volume catches up again. So if this keeps up, I think wear would be increased. I think that's why race engines have such big oil pumps, gotta keep that oil pressure and volume up as those motors zip up and down. That's just one of my theories, anyone care to comment? Those little changes that "modifying" creates aren't often looked at in my opinion, but when a manufacturer hots something up, they HAVE TO.

All that said, 300hp sounds fun, doesn't it? I'm only human you know!

Jason

I dont think you can accuratly look at a race car and derive literal street translations. Theres always race on sunday, sell on monday, but not everyone needs 14" rotors. I cant speak for the VW1.8T, but i have had expierence with the toyota JZ engines. With either the 1jz or 2jz, you can slap on a larger turbo, pump some more fuel and never have a second thought. They come stock with the oil squirters and sump, not to mention some pretty stout manufacturing processes.
In refrence to oil starvation, i dont think that youd run out because of the sudden rpm increase since the oil system has some kind of pressure at all times. The oil isnt going to disappear when the RPMs increase unless youre running some crappy oil. Maybe if youre constantly going from 1k to 10k rpms and back down then you might see some extra wear, but for normal driving/occasional racing it doesnt seem to be an issue. Then again, its dependant on what you start with...

I spent WAY too much time with the wiring harness. It looks like I'm going standalone! I called up 034 Motorsport and they are going to hook me up with a killer system. I like the idea of being able to tune it for the what I want it anyway, and this is a way easier system that uses most of the stock sensors.

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/247649.jpg

I met a guy, Dave S, today. He is a member on GL Forums but hasn't posted yet. Keep your eyes open, it's going to get even crazier around here! Anyway, he had a DBW Mustang and said the throttle response sucked because of it, so I'm kind of glad to be getting rid of the DBW system. I'll be ordering up a cable throttle body tomorrow.

On the cooling front, I installed the bleed area up front. This is at the highest point of the front area of the cooling system. The valve can be opened when the pressure is up a bit in the system, and then any trapped air can be bled off.

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/247651.jpg

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/247653.jpg

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/247656.jpg

Jason

Here's a pic of the rear end in its more or less complete form. Those are 4 piston Wilwood Dynalites. I'm thinking 6 piston up front, black again, and 13 inch rotors. I also have a mechanical brake caliper, but I'm going to have to fab up a bracket for that, it's not a bolt on type affair. Who needs an E brake anyway!

The hole for the strut was opened up a bit more than I would have liked, but it's all done in the name of science!

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/247659.jpg

Jason

That was one scary looking rat nest you had going :eek: ! Glad you found an alternative with 034. That was the exact thing that made me nervous about my conversion, getting a harness/ecu.
It's really starting to come together!



Jeff-

Finished welding the 1.8t chassis components today. Next time I work on it, if it's not raining, I'll be doing sanding, rust removal, primer, and paint next time. I wish I had a TIG welder and knew how to TIG, my MIG welds are strong enough, but don't look so hot and cleaning up splatter is a PITA.

Then it's re-assembly, hoping that nothing got too warped in final welding, and pop the engine in.

Jason

Painted most of the superstructure this weekend. Almost everything fit after final welding, ALMOST. The main assembly pulled together with some triangulation welding quite severly, so I'm going to have to cut and reweld 2 tubes, fortunately the alignment of the superstructure isn't affected by these rascals. I hope someday I'll have welded enough that I'll know better, but for now I'll just muddle along. Everything else looks quite good.

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/260452.jpg

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/260453.jpg

I've got the aluminum coolant lines in position. Walt bent them for me, and they fit into the notch between the body and the pan so tightly they actually stay there without a bracket!

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/260454.jpg

This is the flex line to connect the aluminum hard lines to the radiator. I'll be cutting the aluminum and then adding a flared lip to retain the hose clamp later.

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/260455.jpg

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/260456.jpg

Nice progress Jason :) By the looks of it you will be able to develop an almost bolt in kit for the engine too! Did you weld the aluminium pipes?

Rich

I thought that I followed and read hole your topic; but steering on the back??

WIebrand

I actually built this thing with the idea that it could be put on another car, but I doubt anyone would really want to buy a kit of this nature, it's just too involved. I still have to make the roll bar.

I had Walt do the aluminum welding. He bent them as well. I don't have a set of dies for my bender that small, and I don't have a TIG welder.

I'm going to try to get everything back together and then focus on the braking system for awhile. I kind of jump around from system to system to keep me entertained!

Jason

Yeah, all wheel steering, I didn't tell you? JUST KIDDING! It was just the easiest way to retain the correct dimensions. It will be replaced with something solid mounted in the future, but for now it will suffice.

Jason

Hahaha OKay

Just a shot in the dark here (I am still learning myself about all this malarky!), but wont the tie-rods(that is what they are called, no?) give you the ability to adjust toe-in, toe-out on the wheels? I do know that the steering rack-part will need to be a solid piece in the future though. I just thought that part of that solid piece might still have these tie-rods to allow you to make those adjustments?

Oh, btw, if I haven't introduced myself yet.... My name is Theo, lived in London before moving to France, born in S.Africa though(20km from Jo'burg). Got a 1303 Super(year?) that was refered to by a friend as a "rust bucket" that needs a resto. A '66 Type 3 Fastback and a CombiSplit is in the NEAR future! :D

Your rear suspension and coolant lines look awesome. I just tackled my coolant lines this past weekend. I didn't see your thread before I did it. Too bad, I think it would have helped. Except the Ghia is differant under the heater channels.

Great looking project. The guy I work for just recently bought a TIG welder. It's great. :cool: I had to either put bends in my coolant lines or cut and weld. The TIG welder worked perfect. My aluminum welding needs practice, but the welder was great. :laugh:

Keep the updates coming. :agree:

Hey Theo, great to meet you. One of my good friends here is from S.A., but he's got a disease called rugby. You havn't caught that have you?

Yeah, its just a toe adjustment. They are very common on the rear end of a lot of cars. The inner balljoint will stay in the same position, just the mount will be solid and stable.

Jason

Thanks for the kudos, I'm just muddling along. I need to get a TIG welder, but it's just down the list a bit, behind the plasma cutter!

Jason

We have a plasma cutter too. :laugh: Great for sheet metal. I've used it a bunch on my Ghia, really comes in handy.

I'm very lucky I have a place to work with the tools I have to use, and a place to keep my car while I work on it. :) My project would be just a dream if it wasn't for all of Tim's help.

Everything is back in the car again painted. I had to cut the triangulation at the back of the superstructure. After welding, it distorted enough that I couldn't get it back in. Once those tubes were cut, it went in relatively smoothly.

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/261906.jpg

You can see the angled tubes in this picture at the top back. They need to be welded in place, and I can do that now that the rear window is out..

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/261909.jpg

Jason

Aahhhhh, the game of REAL MEN! Yes, I support the sport too, but am not a FANATIC about it. I prefer motorsports. Motorcycling to be more accurate...... Well, to be exact, MotoGP and WorldSuperbikes!!! :agree:

I get ya! It makes sense. When I saw the set-up, I just thought that it could be of some use :rolleyes:

The motor is back in. It's a tight fit, but it fits! I found out that one of the stock 1.8t coolant hoses will run right into my aluminum side tubes! I swear, I've been surprised again and again how this thing almost feels like it's supposed to be in there. I'll be ordering the standalone EFI tomorrow.

Here's the coolant lines:

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/266772.jpg

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/266770.jpg

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/266768.jpg

Jason

Here's everything in:

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/266773.jpg

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/266774.jpg

http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/266775.jpg

Jason

Recieved the 034 EFI yesterday. Electronics aren't that special to look at. Awefully expensive little box. Also recieved the standard cable throttle body.

Any suggestions for where to get really good quality bulk length cable for a throttle?

Jason

Lokar
They do some really nice streetrod stuff. Didn't see bulk cable on their site but it doesn't hurt to ask.


Jeff-

Thanks Jeff, I fired them off an email to see how long their standard universal cable is. I'm thinking I can probably get bulk throttle cable from a motorcycle shop too, but I'm not sure if it is heavy-duty enough.

Jason

Expect the prices to be high. Their normal clientel has money to burn. I asked them about making me a new dipstick and flexible tube for the Eco (ended up tweaking the orig and using it) and they said "no prob, send the orig for a pattern and we'll have it back in a couple weeks". Remember, this would have been all billet, braided housing, billet bracket, etc. cost about $75-100. Fair enough for a trick piece but pricey for a dipstick.

Jeff-

whats the latest on this car?

The latest is I've been working on the braking system. I've also been renovating a house and taking a CAD course at the local JC, and doing some travelling, so the bugs been a little neglected. Hope to change that within a couple of weekends. Once I move into the new house I'll also have a new garage to work out of that's within earshot instead of being across town.

Jason

excuse my ignorance but is that all wheel steering?

Obviously your not ignorant at all because that is exactly what it is! Only it's not because it won't be utilized on the rear. It is fixed right now, and eventually the steering rack won't be there at all.

Cement work has started for the garage foundations, and I may be able to move into the house this weekend. Front calipers FINALLY showed up today, so this weekend I'll be sending off one of those and one rotor to Lanner.

Sorry nothing too interesting to report, life gets in the way of bug love sometimes!

Jason

Too much time spent trying to finish your own projects! :mad:

Not enough time spent trying to get that front suspension mass produced! :p
(as if I even had a place to put one or the money to spend :bawling: )



Jeff- :laugh:

Jason,

I have been pondering a setup similar to yours. I ran through the ideas of an entire front clip in the rear or using an MR2 rear clip but I have settled on a VTEC motor and trans with a tube subframe or full tube frame. I am wondering how you are going to get your front mount transmission to shift correctly in the rear. I saw on your website you are using a Boxter shifter but have you figured out the linkage yet?

Mike

I used the Boxter shifter because it has the the cable heading out the right way, and I've got it to work, but it's really stiff side to side, where it's supposed to be loose, so either something is up with the tranny, or there's a fundamental difference with how the Porsche tranny works compared to the VW. It can be worked out, I just haven't spent the time yet to figure out where it needs to be tweaked.

Jason