Rack conversion - steering damper?
 

I'm mulling this over, the question is do I really need a damper?

I know that the Polo (from which my rack came) didn't have one in its ordinary setup, only the G40/GTs did. And I know that the beetle has pretty much always had one. The Classic Centrum kit doesn't have one, but given the opportunity I'm wondering whether I should get one.

Just trying to weigh up the pros and cons and whether I can actually source one as it seems nowhere really stocks them, and I'm pretty sure the beetle one won't fit.

Any input guys?


Pros
+Dampens vibration
+Adds stability at speed
+Prevents tramlining on the road
+Easy to fit if one can be sourced
+Easy to retro fit if I really want one

Cons
-Takes away some "feel" of the steering
-Makes steering heavier at low speed
-Can't find one easily!

I fitted one and think its a good idea, especially with larger (heavier) wheels and or brakes.
Mine came from Gerd Weiser (GWD), its a Bilstein gas damper retrofit.

If you can get your hands on one buy it. Try to get the damper brackets as well. I gott one for my setup and it's easy to install and remove if you want to.

http://rejsa.nu/im/_garage/6031-new_...951__kopia.jpg

If you think that the damper ruins your steer feel after you have tried it, then simply remove it. I haven't driven mine with it yet since it's not finished.

Many modern cars have added damping and friction to their steering gears or columns.

I have cad pictures and i have been making these bracket kits to fit polo steering rack to BJ beetle.

http://imageshack.us/m/820/5993/hamm...onkiinnike.jpg

http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/5694/14122010.jpg

http://www.classic-centrum.de/images/lenkung2.jpg

And I can vouch for the quality of Alex's parts :) And thanks for the advice so far tumba your setup looks interesting - would love to see some more pics :)

The bracket for the steering damper/rack mount is avaialble from VW - the polo I got it off didn't have one as it wasn't a GT or G40

Any idea of what length the damper is? I was looking and think that one from an 02/03 might be fine, just without the big rubber doughnut on the rod.

Also for the UJ...! The perfect part as is supplied with the Classic Centrum kit (expensive) has what appears to be the VW Iltis stub and UJ to connect to the rack. I've been looking at Mk1 Golf UJs and wondering if they will fit; the thin spline ones. The thing I like about the later Golf ones is how it all joins together neatly with the bolt together section

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i7...t.jpg~original

Decisions, decisions... Hoping to get my chassis as close to finished as I can when I'm home in a couple of weeks. Just ordered the rear Bilsteins for a good price too :)

Al, the main purpose of a steering damper is to help control the unwanted side effects that are generated by the suspension/steering/brake set up. Big caster angles, large negative scrub radius, big and heavy wheels, powerful brakes, high ratio rack, all will generate a situation where the steering is controlled by the wheel and not the driver. A steering damper adds back some contol to the driver but won't stop the tendency for wheel inputs to want to take over.
You know what the set up is so you will have to be the ultimate arbiter. If it were me, I would do without initially and then fit one if it were needed. If its convenient prepare the barcket locations now so that all you have to do is fit the damper rather than fabricate all the brackets. I would use an 02/03 one so as not to over complicate the issue.

In prepping my '69 for sale, I ended up replacing the steering damper. (steering box, but still relevant) I always thought the vibrations I was getting through the wheel were due to the fact that I used airsoft beads inside my tires instead of traditional stick or hammer-on wheel weights. But in the last month before sale the problem got incredibly worse, which made me consider the steering damper.

The difference between no damper (mine just thunked side to side), and a new damper was night and day. No vibrations through the steering wheel, car is perfectly balanced. I would highly recommend putting a damper in, even with the steering rack conversion.

-Dave

The only worthwhile one is the koni h/d adjustable, Heritage used to do them, may still possibly, i see them as weight i dont need, and haven't used one since my rallycross days, road or track, t'beam or mac strut, and they can also cover up a problem, 'damping it' obviously, with good set up and good wheel and tyre management on events, such as NOT being an F1 driver picking up rubber, i get NO shimmy or shake even with big wheels pushed out to the scrub limits, if you have shimmy, adding Castor adds no weight to the car and will cure it and add more feel. LOTS of rubber builds up INSIDE the front wheels on trackdays, takes 5 mins to pull it all out every run, and it dont half stick in there.
I raced a G.P midget on an oval onetime and this had TWIN s/dampers on it, not my car, and it was a front runner BIG NAME owner, i had some engine work and parts on it, i tried to comment and change things after practise, and would have softened the whole thing off, it was so stiff all round, bumps where the enemy, with revs soaring on them, so maybe the s/dampers were necessary, at least how he liked it set up, ovals are SO specialised, but id have liked to run without them.
Mac strut cars seem more prone to shimmy, but again, find the reason rather than damp it out, on a beam bug, one caster shim for the street works magic.

Cheers chaps - have an 02/03 one on the way.

in writing this I've realised I forgot to order this from the CPC with the last lot of bits.... DOH! another lot of postage. :(

Cost of Rack
 

ALEX - Do you supply the hole kit in RHD. Pls PM me if you do.

Here is some info about this rack and pinion conversion. Rack is from 86 or 86c polo, best years are between 81-94.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswa...2.80.931990.29

You can find used racks with joints from ebay, check uk and german ebay. Quite cheap. Use perhaps word "polo 86c lenkung".


Some info about the parts and conversion, check markhuebbe's posts:


http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/vie...7f0b5f63e78794

All oem brackets can be used. You need:

-1 x beetle steeringbox clamp

-2 x polo rack clamp

-1 x polo tierod bracket to the end of rack

-Equal lenght tierods, oem joints can be used at outer and 10/12mm heim joints at inner.

-Steering joint from polo or aftermarket

-Steering shaft fitted to joint and joint fitted to rack..


Here is a pic of tierod. There is enough lenght at threads if 10-30mm shortening is needed. At the pic i have used as a reference point, stock tierodjoint and Fluro 12mm heimjoint for racing use.


http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/4918/raidetanko1.jpg

I'll post some pics of one of Alex's actual units in RHD when fitted in a couple of weeks time.

Today i am going to order lasercut parts, if someone wants this bracket kit, tell me now. 90 euros kit

I have one rack and pinion bracket kit at the shelf, i can make either RHD or LHD bracket, and for 130 euros welded together and installed M10 and M8 rivetnuts.

http://imageshack.us/m/820/5993/hamm...onkiinnike.jpg


http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/601...iinnikerhd.jpg

The rack mount. Its in paint now and has been drying overnight

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h6...4.jpg~original

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h6...3.jpg~original

Still waiting for a few little bits in the post that are taking an age to get it all finally mounted up.

Al_Kaholik have had some installation problems, i understand his frustation. But there should not be difference between LHD and RHD cars.

I have to say to all that this is not direct bolt on, there is a little fabrication to be done.

My bracket is a accurate copy of classic centrums bracket, so with their bracket there is also same problems. But minor trimming i plan to make to my design.

Few things have came in to my mind

- Upper grease nipple on top tube may need to move littlebit from other side

- Narrowed beam and this style rack kit may not fit together

- Rubber end of the rack comes close to shock, as you can see from link below






http://www.boxergasse.com/html/stefa...tschinger.html


Don't know if there is some differences between various polo racks.

I still think that this polo rack is easiest to adapt to beetle and best is that then you can use long equal lenght tierods.