New to forum - got the questions if you've got the time.

[mabus013]

Hey all. I'm new to the forum here, but not necessarily new to the German Look concept (I was heading in the same direction when I heard about it). I plan on building the sickest, most hardcore Beetle ever seen - as a matter of fact, my intentions are no less than to embarass the hell out of the $100k+ cars that frequent Sport Compact Car magazines Ultimate Street Car Competition - even if I don't win, I at least want those overpriced Supras, Vipers, and Ferraris to break out in a cold sweat.

Now, to the questions...

First, I've heard that the 944 front suspension is based on the Super Beetle's. What are the pitfalls of converting the SB over to 944 parts? Really, this wouldn't be needed, but none of the respected tuner companies really make any parts for this setup (well, Koni does have the struts) and I'm tired of the 'mystery springs' that most companies offer as a direct replacement. I at first thought that I could just grab the front struts (all the way down to the brakes) and the steering box, but a quick glance at the forums tells me that there is more to it. Any alternatives to this conversion, such as a coil over/double A-arm setup?

Second, what exactly can be done with the rear suspension? I'm sure that the rear IRS setup is capable enough, but what can be done about the spring rates? I've seen some cheap coil-overs that bolt in the place of the stock shocks, but the same problem comes up as with cheap front suspension parts (mystery spring rates and adjustability). About the only thing I've seen for the rear is the Kafer Cup reinforcement setup for the tranny mount area.

Third, I've had no luck finding out anything about a fuel injection setup for the aircooled motors, other than the stock VW system, which I'm sure won't be up to snuff for real performance. Is there a system that has the full tuning capabilities, mapping, etc? I was thinking that worse-case scenario I could fab a system out of an existing setup, but I really don't want to open up that can of worms if I don't have to.

Fourth, is there any major faults with the early (70-72) SB chassis? In other words, is there any possible castatrophic tendencies (such as the 911's traditional lift-throttle oversteer) that I need to worry about and correct if possible? I definately don't want to do all of this work to a car just to wrap it around a telephone post due to a chassis weakness I wasn't aware of.

I definately have some more issues, but these right now are my main concerns. I hate to dump all of this on my first post, but I've repeatedly wrote to both VW Trends and Hot VWs and I keep getting the same flak - why I want to do all of that work, why I don't just bolt on some webers and a blue coil and put some big n' littles on it, basically build the same bug everyone else has. Half of those retirees will faint if you even mention nitrous - in my personal opinion, those mags are only good if you're looking to do a pan-off on an old oval and want some swap meet tips. Pretty much the only performance tips are if you want to build a drag-only car or a sandrail. I'd really appreciate if anyone can point me in the right direction on any of these matters.

M13

[Supa Ninja]

For the front Struts on my early Supa I'm running Topline's Maxx Struts, I like them but there are some people on here trying the late 944 Turbo front struts, but I don't know what is better. The setup on the JSport racer is pretty crazy check out the story on that.
I'm going to be going to the '86 944 alloy control arms in the rear. I don't know how its going to work yet.
Redline came out with a very interesting Fuel Injection system for VW's. You can plug a laptop in and make adjustments on the fly. I haven't heard from anyone about how good it work. I believe its www.redlineweber.com for there website.
I've talked to the CalLook guys about GL but they don't understand why I want spend so much time and money on Super Beetle to make it the total package. We are very different mentalities. Kind of like Air and Water folks we don't think the same, thats cool they got there thing and we got ours, GL4LIFE!

Nick

[lightning bug]

These are only my opinions. I'm also using the Maxx struts but using Koni inserts. 944- probably too much time and effort for what its worth. They're coilovers so you have adjustability and you can use pretty much any insert you want. If you're going to go fast you need to stop. 944 brakes are a way to go. you can use all the way up to GT2 6-pistons if you want. However, remember you're stopping an 1800 lb. car. For the rear I'm using stiffer torsion bars, swaybar and probably a KC brace if I don't integrate my cage for this function. I'm not too familiar with rear coil-overs for Bugs. You can do whatever your wallet desires. I'm using stock VW arms in the rear. They are the same as 944 steels only without the camber adjust. Alloy arms will widen your track by a decent amount.
Fuel injection. I'm using SDS. Easy to use with a handheld programmer. No laptop needed. You don't need a laptop unless you want data acquisition and pretty little printouts. Unless you're racing, you really don't need a laptop controlled system. This one has everything you need. www.sdsefi.com They also have links to other manufacturers like MoTec, Electromotive etc.....
Your oversteer/understeer problems will result from your suspension set-up. I wouldn't say it has to do with your car being late or early.
I believe the mags. still aren't getting that there's other things out there other than drag-racing. Supa's right. Drag guys don't get it. I'm building my car for the street and occasional (road) track time. Sure I'll take it to the strip too, but its hard convincing people that I'm not building it to drag race. Take a look at Jak rizzo's car also in the "featured car" section and you'll see what I mean. Good luck dude!!!!

[vujade]

Welcome to the forums

I am building a 71 Super also.
I am currently using the Maxx Struts up front with the
Boge Gas inserts. I definitely like them.

As far as brakes go, I am currently researching all the possible
scenarios for upgrading the brakes.

I have to agree with you about the mags. They are definitely stuck in a drag racing/resto custom mentality. There are never any articles about true performance upgrades/conversions.
I wish there was a US VW magazine that was more like the Sport Compact Tuner mags that catered to ACVW Performance.

I am so glad we have this website to share & learn what is out there in the way of knowledge to further enhance our sport.

Again, welcome to the Forum!

[Steve C]

Hi

Welcome along

If I was starting all over again I would like to do a few things differently.

1/ I would move the tranny forward as described on http://www.beetleracing.com


Gearbox relocation further forward is done easier with the body off the chassis. This is done by reversing the rear cradle (original or after market type), removing the mount on the nose cone and then fitting the Porsche style mount. A hole must be drilled in the torsion bar housing for reverse light operation. The shift rod must be shortened by the amount of the move. A shorter cable is needed ('61 bug is close). We also modify the clutch lever so its angle to the cable is better and longer to make big clutches gentle to operate with less strain on the cable. Some modifications to the firewall is necessary depending on the engine, fan shroud and carburetion used. The benefits from this unusual modification are many. Weight is moved forward, noticeably improving handling. The biggest advantage is when a type 4 engine is installed. The repositioning of the engine and gearbox allows the entire exhaust system including muffler, to fit under a regular Beetle apron.

2/ I would do some chassis & body stiffening like they do on the cabrios.

3/ I would clearance the chassis for a rack & pinion with the chassis off.

There is probably heaps of other things, but this all I can think of at the moment.

Steve C

[mabus013]

I've been thinking about the chassis stiffening part myself. I don't know if I want to do the full cage route - I know that a well designed cage can make a chassis stiffer than practically anything but a tube chassis, but I'm wondering if it's overkill. There's no sense in dropping the moolah for a full chrome-molly cage if there are easier, lighter, and less expensive methods to get acceptable results.

I was thinking that a later supa convertible could be pinned under an early (70-72) body. Presumably, a convertible pan would be stiffer than a sedan chassis (to compensate for the lack of a roof section), and would also have stock front disks and the later rack&pinion steering. Is this feasible?

As for moving the engine forward, is that compatible with the Kafer Cup style braces? Also, has anyone tried using the replacement torsion leaves from Sway-a-way?

Oh, and I have a sneaking suspicion that the five lug Porshe pattern is the same as the five-lug Chevy. Is this true? I really, really like the Torque Thrust II wheels, as well as the new forged Cragar SS wheels, and it's a lot easier to get them at a size I want (I'm thinking 16x7 in the front, 17x10 rear) and correct offset than making due with a stock set of Porshe alloys designed for a completely different application. Does anyone know what the TTII/SS wheels weigh? Are they fairly light, or they heavy?

Thanks again, keep the info coming.
M13

[lightning bug]

A cage is mainly for protection. If you're only concerned about stiffening the car, there are other routes to go. I don't believe its the pan that's reinforced on a vert. Its the body thats reinforced. There are numerous parts on the market to make your car handle and stiffen the chassis as well. Have you checked the galleries yet? There's alot of pics there to give you an idea of possibilities.

[NO_H2O]

Porsche bolt patern is 5X130mm I don't think you will get Porsche wheels on a Chevy hub.